Tribe.net. Local Connections Vicky Jo http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#e06780f0-8993-4103-a470-a096c968cad7 2009-12-07T03:31:30Z 2009-12-07T03:31:30Z

LOL! I don't think there's a so-called "reliable test" for anything psychological as it happens. And technically, I dislike the term "left brain" immensely, because everyone alive uses both the right and left hemispheres of their brain. Everyone alive uses both rational and irrational (judging and perceiving) processes or they would be... dead. So what is "left-brained" then? How shall we define it for the sake of this conversation? Well, speaking for myself, I am employing the term "left-brain" to connote extraverted Thinking specifically. It is probably the *most* so-called "left brain" function. Now in the words of my INTJ husband, he prefers things to be logical, defensible, and he tends toward "compulsive explaining" -- meaning he frequently will tell you WHY something is the way it is -- whether you want to know or not. We both know from over a decade of experience as MBTI practitioners that INTJs often struggle to embrace their irrational (intuiting) side -- what we MIGHT call the "right-brain." This conflict is typically due to the culture valuing their "left-brain" contributions so highly, which sets up an internal struggle in INTJs as they struggle to demonstrate competence -- a core value for them. According to Jung (who had INTJ preferences himself), here is what extraverted Thinking is like: "This type [endeavors] to make all his activities dependent on intellectual conclusions, which in the last resort are always oriented by objective data, whether these be external facts or generally accepted ideas. This type... elevates objective reality, or an objectively oriented intellectual formula, into the ruling principle not only for himself but for his whole environment....Everything that agrees with this formula is right, everything that contradicts it is wrong, and anything that passes by it indifferently is merely incidental....The thinking of the extraverted type is positive, i.e., productive. It leads to the discovery of new facts or to general conceptions based on empirical material. It is usually synthetic, too. Even when it analyses, it constructs, because it is always advancing beyond the analysis to a new combination, to a further conception which reunites the analysed material in a different way or adds something to it." -C.G. Jung, Psychological Types (#585, 592) Now "oriented by objective data, whether these be external facts or generally accepted ideas" usually means "left-brain" in my book. So does "empirical." And if W. Harold Grant is correct, and the auxiliary process is developed between the ages of 12-20, that means INTJs would look pretty "left-brain" from age 12 onward if they are developing properly and using their god-given functions. Ergo, it seems curious to me that an INTJ would be "becoming more 'left-brain'" if they are much older than 12 years old. In later years, it would more likely be the Tertiary function (as with E_FPs) or the Inferior function (as with I_FPs), or someone developing it in their shadow process (as I have begun doing; it is my 7th function). I hope this logic is sufficient for you. -Vicky Jo :-)

Vicky Jo 2009-12-07T03:31:30Z Wyatt http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#de693cf0-7d0b-4cbe-9fd6-8734c8620ab0 2009-12-06T21:49:16Z 2009-12-06T21:49:16Z

"..., let's just say that most INTJs are "left-brained" (as you call it) from a very young age...." And is there a reliable test for this? I believe I come MUCH closer to being bi-brained than most people I know. I operate quite well and efficiently in both worlds. My creative side often finds trouble coping in the corporate engineering world, in general, because of the conservative nature the buisness has (they tend to not want to try anything that they haven't done before for fear of failure... and I am quite willing to risk it if I believe an idea is a valuable one.... only to be cut off from funding because its too "risky"). And their logic is flawed (1. we haven't done it before 2. there will be mutltiple things that we cannot foresee that prevent us from finishing on time 3. we fail). It should be more like (1. it is a good idea... if it works, it generates a fundamental competitive edge not only in the application, but drives a new technology for the next generation of 5 other applications 2. We should build in the schedule multiple prototypes incase the first one fails, and use that as a learning experience 3. Where there is a will, there is a way... it will work, with some possible delays.)

Wyatt 2009-12-06T21:49:16Z Vicky Jo http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#cc40e3fc-47f5-4b2f-b316-7bb784ad1b68 2009-12-05T07:08:50Z 2009-12-05T07:08:50Z

Jessica, I would suggest that the psychology field is flooded with INTJs. Robert Kegan, Tal Ben-Shahar, and David Rock to name a few. However, I notice that reading your post throws up a few flags for me, and I wonder how you came by your type preferences? For one thing, let's just say that most INTJs are "left-brained" (as you call it) from a very young age... and since type patterns don't change (only reported type does), I notice it's creating some hesitancy in me. Of course, you would be far from the only mis-typed INTJ in the world if you are. Are you willing to explore whether you're mis-typed? -Vicky Jo :-)

Vicky Jo 2009-12-05T07:08:50Z SUPER☾ALI http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#47f7dd56-10b6-42f1-9bb5-180e50dface0 2009-12-05T06:44:20Z 2009-12-05T06:44:20Z

can't help but rub salt in the wound i'm so evil but this thread is the antithesis to your constricted awareness of the INTJ type, Vicky Jo. know-it-all.. *grr*

SUPER☾ALI 2009-12-05T06:44:20Z Jessica http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#019c4ff0-71f5-4874-841a-a168cffdc449 2009-12-05T06:29:05Z 2009-12-05T06:29:05Z

Wow. I'm so amazed to find all these posts because this is exactly how I feel! When I went to college I changed my major twice, and now that I'm working in "my field" I'm looking into other career possibilities! Currently I work at a newspaper performing very boring photo production tasks all day. I'm going crazy! The only thing that has been positive is I've started my own photography business on the side. But, those gigs are far and few between . . . I've always thought teaching would be challenging, but have been fearful of the routine of teaching the same curriculum over and over again. Seems like some of you have had that experience?! Does anyone know an INTJ who is a psychologist or counselor? I imagine applying theory to a practice that helps people may be a great and rewarding challenge. But, the $$ and schooling are intense, so it's a decision not to be taken lightly! I always thought the arts would be fulfilling, and they have been (first dance and now photography), but as I get older I have become more left-brained, and my desire to be challenged everyday and make a living doing it grows stronger! Any suggestions? I am actually not mathematically inclined, so engineering and computer programming do not sound appealing to me. So glad there are other INTJ's who feel similar out there!

Jessica 2009-12-05T06:29:05Z Emily A. http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#bb2ef6bd-d1d3-4bf8-bb76-459f1f7088f1 2009-11-19T02:03:08Z 2009-11-19T02:03:08Z

I get extremely bored at jobs. I need a challenge. I also need someone to lay off my back. I do not like being looked over. I perform best when I am left to my own devices. I am content with knowing the agenda and carrying it out. The bored/restless issue seems to be a problem when there is not a creative component involved. When there is not a creative component, ie; room for innovation, I want to dart. I hate it. Absolutely despise it. Moreover, I dislike not being consulted for my creative and practical ideas. I dislike routine and tradition... they bore me to death. You could say for me stagnation -is- death. I need constant challenge. I solved the problem; I went into business for myself. I am in the process of building my own life coaching practice now. I specialize in intrapersonal coaching.

Emily A. 2009-11-19T02:03:08Z Ian http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#9f991093-28ea-4342-9ac7-abe800e176d7 2009-11-07T15:55:59Z 2009-11-07T15:55:59Z

You know something.... this thread really got me thinking. One day, I decided to think hard about who I'd like to be in the shoes of and what I would truly love to get a career in. The one person that came to mind was simply David Attenborough. Now, although he is a very fortunate man and very unique I still felt like doing the kind of thing he is doing. Zoology and Anthropology. The study of wildlife and humans has always come naturally to me and I'd enjoy every day of it as a career. Is that something an INTJ would say? I'm supposed to be INTJ but the idea of spending my life as an 'Engineer' actually bores me.

Ian 2009-11-07T15:55:59Z Lilly http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#2ed519a6-0a9b-4bab-b988-e524b5de1df5 2009-11-06T22:46:55Z 2009-11-06T22:46:55Z

Yes. so I am not the only one this happens too. I have not found that career and thats what I am worried about with college and my major how to be sure I will enjoy it.

Lilly 2009-11-06T22:46:55Z INTp http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#adddf1bc-3ba4-442b-8328-19997774db62 2009-08-30T16:55:29Z 2009-08-30T16:55:29Z

Science & engineering, ideally the two combined together. There are so many hard problems, you'll never get bored :)

INTp 2009-08-30T16:55:29Z David http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#fef39fa8-d86c-42dd-8b9e-543ffd4798aa 2009-08-07T18:23:15Z 2009-08-07T18:23:15Z

YES! Yes! And yes! I have given up on the idea of finding the "perfect" career. I started of in retail - boring; I found earth sciences interesting while at university, but field work is not interesting. I drifted into the world of business (parental influence) - accounting and finance. Dreadful stuff! I worked as an auditor, slide into the investment field, and eventually into the insurance field. I had another friend who suggested computer programming. So, I went down that road. The logical process is interesting. After my training in programming, I picked up a job teaching at the same college. I've been teaching computer applications and business for 13 years. I'm 53 now and I have been searching for the "perfect" career for decades. As others have already posted, I quickly learn "everything" that is "worth" learning about the job or field and the the bordom sets in. The life-time of a job usually is between 1 to 3 years and then the quiet desperation begins. Yes, I am INTJ. Although, I tend to be very close the the center point between J and P.

David 2009-08-07T18:23:15Z James http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#a3fa5f4f-1d8b-4158-abe5-079587f6dc94 2009-03-18T18:17:59Z 2009-03-18T18:17:59Z

I worked for HP notebook technical support as a support technician - this was a very enjoyable job at first - it allowed me to use logical thinking to address technical issues - eventually i created logic paths and process that could resolve any issues we encountered - held this position for a year and became bored with it. Got promoted to second level support (basically assisting level one techs) which was great once again because: - i could take the process's i developed and teach them to other people - instead of resolving 10 - 15 technical issues a day, i would resolve 70 to 100 (i just came up witht he solution and made the level one do all the work of implementing it) Once again after a year, this became so boring Got promoted to a trainer where i would train new hires and provide recursive training to current employees. challenging role at first but after doing a few classes it was boring. So i decided to observe and then improve the training material and process's, but the company had issue in the higher level of management with recognizing that a little peon as myself could come up with ways of doing things better then them. so once again- time to move on - this time into a management position - i was so bored with technical issue that i though people issues would be challenging - i quickly realized that people issues are illogical and it made my brain hurt at some of the stupidest and most irrelevant things that i would have to deal with when it came to people issues. (example: i don't want to hear that you wont follow this process because your dog died 2 years ago. wtf does you dog have to do with your job - god people issues are annoying as hell) anyway - every career , position, company i have ever worked for has become boring after a year. - only logical solution = continue charging jobs every year - its working so far

James 2009-03-18T18:17:59Z Vicky Jo http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#5a1e128d-7cf9-4eef-8fd3-e50e2cf6622a 2009-03-03T18:33:30Z 2009-03-03T18:33:30Z

Just to say this throws up flags for me. It's hard to conceive of an INTJ "bouncing" from one thing to the next. Given that their auxiliary process is extraverted Thinking, which one expert describes as "planning," it's hard to imagine an INTJ who isn't "planning" on a fairly consistent basis. Maybe you could say more about that phrase in order to clarify. Thanks. -Vicky Jo :-) www.TypeInsights.com

Vicky Jo 2009-03-03T18:33:30Z Natalia http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#f8d91e58-ed0e-46c9-a699-a595e995a54b 2009-03-03T17:52:20Z 2009-03-03T17:52:20Z

Hi Kristin, I have the same problem as you being an INTJ (don't remember the percentage bit). However, I seem to bouce from one thing to another. I just don't have a clue. Considering the world of project/programme management rather than just management itself because you can get contracts that change every 3 years or so...the theory is that different workplace different project will minimise the likelihood of getting bored?! Might be worth you considering. I may be wrong though, so any comments to back me up / let me know if I'm wrong would be great.

Natalia 2009-03-03T17:52:20Z matthew http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#58c8b126-1975-4ae0-a035-2e9c7c4a79d8 2009-03-03T06:25:32Z 2009-03-03T06:25:32Z

I too am considering law school. Just trying to find a way to juggle that with a wife and child (and future children?). That makes it a little harder. After graduating with an English degree, I wasn't sure what to do so I waited tables and since then I have sold insurance (for 3 days - not to be done again), sold newspaper advertising space, been a service dispatcher, and am now a computer support specialist. This last job (for the past 3 years) has been the best, but there are definitely days I'm tired of the same old "my <fill in the blank> isn't working" template. For those interested in variety - there isn't a whole lot of money in it, but you could always temp. I did dozens of different jobs from telemarketing to cleaning screens for a screen-printing company. Jobs from a couple days to a couple of months. Interesting work. My favorite job though, was a camp counselor - now that kept me on my toes.

matthew 2009-03-03T06:25:32Z Paul http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#6153ad32-4171-4e6d-8103-b7517808307f 2009-02-02T08:35:48Z 2009-02-02T08:35:48Z

I'm also an INTJ.I'm now studying medicine and I'm getting bored with med science.I found it interesting when I was a fresh man. I failed the 2nd year exam and still a sophomore.Senior sophomore :). I failed not because I have a low IQ level but because I got bored . What I hate most is Anatomy , coz you have to memorize all the stuffs. I like to figure out body parts in my mind when reading but I hate to memorize and repeat again again. You don't have to think logically or creatively when learning med science , esp anatomy.You just have to understand what's written and memorize. I just hate it.I was designing web pages last year and now I'm getting bored again. I'm just confused. I don't attend classes regularly and I'm using internet about 5 hours a day these days .Just to find out what's the most appropriate job for an INTJ type person.I took many career tests that lead nowhere.And also IQ tests. The last test says my IQ is 160, which means I can be a scientist or inventor or like that.I just don't know what to do. I wanna be a scientist or inventor ,but I don't know my strongest talent till now. Most INTJ"s get bored when they have to do the same things again and again. They don't like "same,same". They just want to do different things each and everyday . That's why they jump from one career to another.Med science is the worst one for INTJ's ,I think. Coz you have to repeat reading so as to remember the stuffs. The new developments in med science are not very interesting and the won't keep you interested in it. The following jobs may be the good ones for INTJ's computer programmer writer research scientist Philosopher psychiatrist / psychologist designer politics or law (you'll find studying boring, but one you start your career as a lawyer or politician you'll love it, most INTJ's are logical and like to solve problems ) Learning new languages. Teaching is not good for INTJ's. You'll have to go through the same damned cycles again and again.

Paul 2009-02-02T08:35:48Z B http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#af758f34-d72c-4339-88a3-68c2ae7012cc 2009-01-24T13:30:04Z 2009-01-24T13:30:04Z

Here is my experience as an INTJ: I studied a variety of fields in college: computer science (main), graphic design, and business. Business did not seem to have enough challenge for me. Computer science was a nice challenge in college and workforce, but not the best fit for me. Graphic design was nice, but I had difficulty being creative. Also, working with creative/free flowing types can be frustrating because they are not always efficient. Now, I have seriously been considering law school (or possible law/MBA program) as a new career option. My only fear is that I will be unsatisfied once again as I enter the field (which has been mentioned in other posts). If you are an INTJ that has been through law school, could you elaborate on your experience in the field? LB, could you explain what aspect is already making you bored? Thanks!

B 2009-01-24T13:30:04Z LB http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#15b92600-b673-46c1-a7e7-59260fb08d10 2009-01-20T21:26:20Z 2009-01-20T21:26:20Z

It seems like there are a lot of us flailing about in our careers...I've been a nurse for many years (never wanted to be one-I just fell into it). I've worked in way over a dozen different areas/specialties and don't care for any of them. I graduated from law school--but was already bored working in 2 law firms during school. Now I'm looking for something I can tolerate for a couple years until I change jobs/careers again. I have decided that my career is "looking for a career". It's extremely comforting to see that there are others like me out there - I have always been seen as unstable or flighty - even though I have always excelled at whatever I have tried.

LB 2009-01-20T21:26:20Z naveen http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#6bfad73f-2fde-4376-bdd0-c38a53dff272 2009-01-08T04:07:40Z 2009-01-08T04:07:40Z

i am into the medical field.planning to do post graduation in surgery.there is instant gratification and one doesnt have to be touchy feely to patients in there...there isnt much of a need to interact with people..lol..since they wud be put to sleep when am working on them..and the operation room environment is pretty organised,neat and clean with no bull shit talks.most importantly,unlike a physician,a surgeon doesnt have to please people with pep talks..

naveen 2009-01-08T04:07:40Z Luna http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#9901b362-f31b-443f-a664-784c86397cc8 2008-04-07T05:43:47Z 2008-04-07T05:43:47Z

I feel a bit out of my league here to offer advice?opinions? (being infj) but I find that INTJs do well in careers that match the theoretic with some practical -based (read: instant gratification) job. I have several really close INTJ friends and I've noticed that the ones working in jobs that do not have a real-world immediate outcome are *not* as happy... my INTJ friends that ARE happiest are in the following jobs: 1) electrical engineer (like Wyatt) :-) 2) helping to create various start-ups 3) an INTJ returning to school to study environmental science (after having an earlier career in business) (the process of re-generation) :-) these areas seem to keep the INTJ's mind stimulated enough (with a balance of theory and immediacy of result) ... so that boredom, depression, and/or getting sucked into the weakest/achillies heal 4th function of Extroverted sensory does not overtake their own self containment & inner strength... INTJs have a lot of drive (this is an understatement, of course) (smile) ... to create... to do the right thing... to make their impact....to achieve but the goal needs to match their ability... and so.. often boredom sets in :-( I think that another area of excellent mind-engagement & real-world outcome is in the area of law (as *i think?* Unsu... mentioned) (not as lawyer per se...but perhaps as a judge) Under the tough-as-nails outer strength... I have found that INTJs have an amazing depth of justice, fairness, and compassion! (probably why I feel so safe and in admiration of my friends) :-) In regards to why I would recommend studying to become a judge rather than lawyer.... it is because I think that INTJs DO need their privacy ...and do not like pandering to people ...or selling themselves so much....which is a common reality as a lawyer... I think ENTPs make great lawyers, however) my other INTJ friends that are NOT so happy in the following jobs: 1) software engineer ( i have two friends in this field - one owns his own company and both are completely stressed out every day) 2) theoretical mathematician (he is ok but stressed & bored all the time) 3) chemistry work -- I don't know if the ones that are stressed out & bored is related to their work or their inner emotional situations... but I began to suspect .. that (while INTPs do very well in very structured but very theoretical fields) there is a real need for some immediate gratification for INTJs in their work...which might be related to the fourth shadow Se function-- (i don't think this is unhealthy...just natural) An INTJ who is passionate about their work... is a fairly happy autonomous INTJ... An INTJ who feels a void/ boredom in work... is likely to find other ways to fill the void :-( (ex: sensory gratification.....of which they will not necessarily be satisfied with anyway) wow- that was a long one! sorry guys/gals :-( anyway, hope everyone finds their niche!!

Luna 2008-04-07T05:43:47Z Sheppard http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#c13afd0c-2491-4df2-b242-e7dc5e27f081 2008-04-01T02:10:22Z 2008-04-01T02:10:22Z

I'm in the same situation. I'm 52 y/o now. Too old to continue my landscaping business. Started a consulting business but it will never be a huge money maker. Have no savings, no retirement...and now I'm trying to find something else I can do that I will be successful at.

Sheppard 2008-04-01T02:10:22Z Joshua http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#15409ad7-3c31-49b0-893f-a56504c945a8 2008-03-05T06:06:01Z 2008-03-05T06:06:01Z

I'm curious about this too, because boredom has been a problem for me. I also was a teacher for several years, and am similarly high on the N scale. For the past couple years I've had my own contracting business. As this amounts primarily to little more than manual labor, it is ineluctable death to an INTJ, who needs to feed his brain with fairly constant supply of fresh ideas. Although teaching is not as intelectually stimulating as learning, a good solution for you may be to work for a PhD and then get a professorship: the teaching is more advanced and less rote, and then there's the opportunity to conduct your own research. I would probably go this route myself, but I have a large family to raise. For the present, making music is a way to keep myself occupied. . .

Joshua 2008-03-05T06:06:01Z Vicky Jo http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#0be6ccb3-4f37-48f9-9ef4-fb07eaed7e45 2008-02-27T04:40:59Z 2008-02-27T04:39:34Z

>>100% N<< The assessment does not "measure" how much "N" you have. All the scores reveal is how confident you are that you have a given preference. The lower the score, the greater the possibility the result might really be the other letter; the higher the score, the more likely it is that you have gotten the correct letter. However, it happens all the time that somebody is dead certain they prefer something that they don't! No personality test is capable of testing "how much" of a cognitive process you have -- in fact, the very idea doesn't make any sense. It would be like wondering how "toenail" or "ear" you are. It isn't even logical. Take it from a professional facilitator who is MBTI qualified and certified, and has over a decade's worth of experience.

Vicky Jo 2008-02-27T04:39:34Z LynneFL http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#985e82f6-12f0-4bb6-858d-26002f915192 2008-02-26T20:14:45Z 2008-02-26T20:14:45Z

Yes. I do kind of bore easily, although I stay in my careers because I have bills to pay. I worked in broadcast journalism for 11 years...five as a radio announcer, and the last six as a news producer and assignment editor. I also worked as a copy writer for an internet firm for a few months. Right now, I'm working as a reasearcher and have been doing so for two years. I enjoy learning about different things, but I've gotten bored because we're starting to do the same things over and over again.

LynneFL 2008-02-26T20:14:45Z Warren http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#02e997ae-1c9c-4dcb-a801-8c8f9e030711 2007-11-22T11:20:18Z 2007-11-22T11:20:18Z

I think business is the best thing. For INTJs, I think learning about how to be good in relationships is a very interesting process. As business is about relationships and relationships is a pretty much never ending flow of new information, that should keep you interested. The goal is big enough; the challenge is big enough. -------------------- INTJ Personal Development - http://www.whatithinkabout.com

Warren 2007-11-22T11:20:18Z Wyatt http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#b1e8d3e5-f132-43b6-b622-64737a50f98b 2007-10-20T19:18:29Z 2007-10-20T19:18:29Z

I feel for ya, brother. Engineering curriculm was the same mono-personality temprament pull (so to speak). No ENFP's there... hell, there were barely any females there. I didn't even know they existed until i started attending, oh, i dunno, FAIRIE FESTIVALS and RENNESAINCE FESTIVALS!?!!??

Wyatt 2007-10-20T19:18:29Z $item.owner.firstName http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#f6b0b366-f263-4d66-9626-30db914252b5 2007-10-20T19:06:46Z 2007-10-20T19:06:46Z

Thanks Wyatt! To be honest, it's not all flowers and candy. Law school, at least for the first two years, control and hijack your life. Then there's the whole work/life balance, which, for some lawyers, is heavily tipped in favor of work. Then there's the issue of personality types. Law school and the law is pretty self-selective, such that you don't see a lot of, say, ENFPs at school or the work corridors. A lot of NT's, SJs, INTJs, etc find themselves drawn to this field. This lack of diversity can be draining at times, from a personal/social standpoint.

$item.owner.firstName 2007-10-20T19:06:46Z Wyatt http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#55f5c083-d5e2-432e-a76c-c322764c463e 2007-10-20T18:46:21Z 2007-10-20T18:46:21Z

<<I would have been the lawyer who secretly screened out his jury pool based on MBTI and Keirsey Temperament.>> Because when you are wrong, argue the facts. When you right, argue the law. When you want justice, settle it between yourselves. When you want a decsicion, settle it in court.

Wyatt 2007-10-20T18:46:21Z Wyatt http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#c9f77fdf-6763-495d-afe0-5c68861378dd 2007-10-20T18:35:12Z 2007-10-20T18:35:12Z

Heh. r21left likes to think in 3-dimensional Venn diagrams going thorough dynamic transformation. How very INTJ of him... roflmao!!! I considered being a lawyer for a while. I often thought I would have enjoyed it. I think I would have liked being a trial lawyer. I don't know that I would have actually been any good at winning people over on anything other than logic, though. And that usually won't do it unless I had a jury full of NTs. Heh, I would have been the lawyer who secretly screened out his jury pool based on MBTI and Keirsey Temperament. I dunno, maybe they do that anyway. It would be a smart move. Good luck on the bar exam!

Wyatt 2007-10-20T18:35:12Z $item.owner.firstName http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#270e8658-59e3-43db-869f-73b3663eb969 2007-10-20T17:51:54Z 2007-10-20T17:51:54Z

*should be "landmark litigation," not "landmark legislation."

$item.owner.firstName 2007-10-20T17:51:54Z $item.owner.firstName http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#75a8f847-0e47-4d4b-b5a5-b5203c8af025 2007-10-20T17:49:56Z 2007-10-20T17:49:56Z

I'm studying law. I'm a few months away from taking the bar exam. I think it's the perfect field for me. Of course, there's lots of sub-fields and specializations in law, but there's enough variety to make me happy. I don't see myself becoming a trial lawyer (in part because I don't like to pander to a jury, or the judge for that matter. I don't even think I want to be in a courtroom, because I see the judiciary as but one actor in a complicated machinery of making society function. I'm much more concerned with being in a position where my efforts will have maximal impact - crafting enabling legislation that will help institutions become more efficient, writing amicus briefs to the highest court in a landmark legislation (though note that I wouldn't want to argue that case myself - this requires years of specialization), organizing a grassroots movement to, say, support public financing of campaigns (the reform that makes all other reform possible!). Like Wyatt, I also deal with what I can't see and thus have to imagine. Law deals with categories of permissible conduct, impermissible conduct, mutually exclusive jurisdictions, overlapping jurisdictions, etc. To help me make sense of laws, I like to visualize a sphere that contains the conduct in question. Everything outside it is excluded, or is impermissible. As the law changes, some conduct is added, some deleted, other spheres may overlap, absorb, be absorbed, merge, split off, or the entire mechanism may be scrapped in favor of starting from scratch - as when tort liability for medical malpractice is disfavored for malpractice medical boards, for example. Law for me involves logic, theory, application, history, politics, justice, and humanity. I couldn't think of a better profession.

$item.owner.firstName 2007-10-20T17:49:56Z Wyatt http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#7a134c0f-a375-415f-ba94-9ed22f6a7382 2007-10-20T17:17:07Z 2007-10-20T17:17:07Z

John, I certainly share your sentiments toward a career in which you are always able to improve, create, and learn new things. I believe it is important for the INTJ psyche to be able to operate in a relatively autonomous way, with at least "some" degree of freedom for creativity and putting our own soul into our work so that we are able to transorm the end result from what was, to what is (new and improved, of course). For myself, I love incredibly detailed and complex problems. I must see the forrest AND the trees-- ALL AT THE SAME TIME. I am an Electrical Engineer, and design power supplies and hardware. Also, I have much experience in semiconductor manufacturing and product development. INTJ's were built for engineering. At least, this one was. It is where the rubber meets the road. Theory applied, and all of the non-idealities that make theory fall apart before we reconstruct it again with an improved workable model. For me, it HAD to be Electrical Engineering in the end. Mathematics in Civil and Mechanical were toooo concrete. It was too easy to visualize it and do it. I needed something I couldn't see to stimulate more imagination. Can't really see electrons. And those darn imaginary numbers took a while to grab a hold of, too. Heh. The funny thing is, the farther up the mathematics chain I went, the more abstact and useless it became in the real world, and the better I got at it. I am best at solving utterly useless mathematical abstractions. But I am also good at finding real world applications for the abstractions. Not the most fun, but it is somewhat rewarding to me. Heh. Mathematical equations are the language of Mathematics, which is the science of recognizing patterns. Physics and Chemistry (all the same at upper level anyway) are the natural laws of our "universe" that we exist in. Engineering exploits those laws, and uses the mathematical science and language to meet an end. Heh. INTJ's were built for Engineering. At least this one was.

Wyatt 2007-10-20T17:17:07Z Bill http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#573ca5c7-19c4-468d-b6b0-11e0e8f5da0c 2007-10-20T16:48:41Z 2007-10-20T16:48:41Z

Wow...100% is pretty high...my N is around 53%. I share your boredom with careers. I have always liked very detailed and technical things. I am currently a production editor for a weekly magazine. What I do is basically trail behind the graphic designers and make sure what they designed will actually print. This involves using a 35+-step checklist for each and every layout in a weekly 60-page magazine. After about one year, I became severely bored. Another year has gone by and I am still there, with great resentment. The funny thing is, I had left a job before that one, unsure if I would be good enough for this one. I think I've proven otherwise. I, too, am in search of something that will keep me interested. I've thought about delving further into graphic design (at least I know MY files will work, lol) or Web design. Not sure if that will hold my interest either. P.S. - I've done the management thing and got frustrated, as well.

Bill 2007-10-20T16:48:41Z john http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#d6b9d8fc-fd83-4f4d-935e-f24962153d9c 2007-10-19T12:49:15Z 2007-10-19T12:49:15Z

Software development. The only constant is that things are constantly changing. Always something to create or improve. I hate Fridays and look forward to Mondays...

john 2007-10-19T12:49:15Z Kristin http://INTJ.tribe.net/thread/56252807-ac3e-49f7-8f37-5de5564986ba#5543c018-5121-4633-a061-764318810c14 2007-10-19T02:51:37Z 2007-10-19T02:51:37Z

Are there any INTJs out there that have found careers that keep them interested? I get bored so easily... once I figure out the basics of a career and have learned most of the principles behind it I become bored and restless. What was once an interesting job becomes unbearable. I was a teacher for a couple of years but quickly figured out that, while I love learning in school, teaching what I already know to others is boring. And I get frustrated when others don't try their best - so management didn't work out too well, either. I am grateful for my teaching experience, though, becuase I think it helped me to better develop the E and F sides of my personality. Not sure what to try next.. I love school but once I'm out there in the real world doing the job I'm ready to learn something else. Business/finance does not interest me at all. Also, my N is at 100%! Has anyone else had such a high score on N or know what this might mean in terms of careers?

Kristin 2007-10-19T02:51:37Z